Green sparks indeed

windtowerburningGreen Sparks Flying says Queensland's Sunday Mail reporter Steven Wardill and  sub heads the article Alternative energy revolution hits Queensland. OK, you got my attention.
A large scale solar and wind revolution has been sparked in Queensland with 17 proposed projects capable of powering more than a million homes.
Sounds impressive!
Valued at more than $2.4 billion the new Queensland based investments would halt the the exporting of green energy jobs to southern states.  Premier Annastacia Palasczuk said the government's policies were helping to attract investment, create jobs and combat climate change.
So far, so good.
Combined, the projects would deliver 1000 megawatts of baseload power.
Oops Solar an wind can't deliver  baseload power for very obvious reasons and the $2.4 billion costs of the project are going to cost $10.8 billion worth of subsidies to reach the target. Oh, and the 17 projects are not going to happen at all, at least not in the near future.
And the government will have to attract significantly more investment as well as provide financial support to meet the 50% target to prevent significantly pushing up power prices.
Just in case you thought the article might still have some legitimacy the energy Minister Mark Bailey closes:
While Queensland led the world in household solar installations, the state was behind it's southern counterparts.
Which to me says we don't lead the world at all, our southern counterparts do. Do people really read and understand what these left wing Green idiots are on about. An Alternative energy revolution isn't going to hit Queensland any time soon If your hanging in there for a Telsa storage battery then start saving. At the moment Australians gearing to add battery-stored solar energy to grid power can buy Elon Musk’s long-awaited Tesla Powerwall system from today. You’ll pay $15000 or more for a full system. Yeah...right.  I'll check my piggy bank.

41 comments

  • An Alternative energy revolution isn’t going to hit Queensland any time soon
    Been to Ravenshoe recently, Kev? – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windy_Hill_Wind_Farm
    I used to take my kids to see it when we visited rellies in FNQ. They’re all grown up now. It’s been there since 2000, quietly generating power with no fuss or controversy.
    Opposition to renewable energy has nothing to do with economics and everything to do with ideology.
    As for subsidies, the fossil fuel industries have been committing GBH on my taxpayer dollar for years – http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-11/coal-oil-and-gas-companies-receive-4-billion-dollar-in-subsidie/5881814

  • You do get confused. There is no opposition to renewable energy here. The opposition is to people who believe that renewable energy is an answer now. It isn’t. Every wind and solar farm only work because they are subsidised by us poor punters. I wouldn’t mind if it was just the Green filth who had subsidize it but everyone cops it.
    Unquestioning support of renewable energy has nothing to do with economics and everything to do with ideology. Whereas I support renewable energy research so that one day we might have a better solution the Green filth support it as much to cripple the economy and close down coal mines as anything else. While India are trying to bring their billions onto 24/7 power grids the Green filth are trying their level best to keep them in poverty.
    Their attitude to renewable energy is best summed up by the article. Full of inaccuracies, downright lies and ideological drivel. That is what the article is about and it is my point. Your “look here a Wind Farm” does nothing to explain the article’s shortcomings.

  • Hello 17…

    You seem addicted to misreading some of the posts which you then comment on. Kev wrote: “An Alternative energy revolution isn’t going to hit Queensland any time soon”.

    You then started banging on about Ravenshoe which doesn’t produce enough energy to light a TOC H lamp when the wind doesn’t blow.

    Do you really believe an energy source which can’t produce energy 24/7/365 is revolutionary?

    Likewise, may we have the details of the wind and/or solar system you have fitted to your home and on which you now rely for 100% of your power for 100% of the time?

    If you don’t have such a system it will almost certainly be because you cannot store the energy at reasonable cost.

    Any chance you might consider putting the horse before the cart and coming up with an efficient, reliable and affordable storage system before again trying to jam your ugly wind and solar contrivances down our throats?

    • I’ve been around for a while and can remember growing up in North Queensland without electricity.
      We survived.
      As for my place (not that it’s any of your business) we’re on the grid. It’s not 100% reliable – occasionally we have blackouts. You could argue about affordability. It’s very poor value for money, because we pay for the network as well as what we consume. That’s a weird notion when you think about it.
      I don’t have a Tesla system because at the moment we don’t need it, but in case you haven’t noticed, technology marches on. Conservatives often have difficulty understanding that simple notion. Don’t worry, it will happen, whether you understand it or not. The major power retailers are beginning to sell battery technology to their customers. They can see the writing on the wall, and are trying to ensure that the disruptive effects of renewables don’t wreck their business model. What will be a game changer is the emerging technology which will allow consumers to trade the energy they develop with each other, completely bypassing the power generators. That will be interesting.
      Community based renewables will be very disruptive. Ask the taxi industry……

  • I’m not the one confused.
    A few facts –
    1. The fossil fuel industry is heavily subsidised and has been for years.
    2. There is nothing in Green policy designed to “cripple the economy”.
    3. There is enormous vested interest in the petrochemical industry.
    4. The article quotes statical data. Point out the “lies” and “inaccuracies”.

  • He has boxed himself in again, let’s not answer the question, let’s start on another rant. I don’t think that he realises he is talking to adults, not his usual run of students.

  • !. Yeah…the left always go on about that. Maybe…maybe not but at least it works.
    2. Adani, James Point, close down all coal mines, stop live cattle export, stop uranium mining, stop all mining, stop commercial fishing and the list goes on.
    3. Of course there is. The world depends on it to move
    4. I already have. That is what the post is about.

  • Hello 17….

    You have not answered the questions I asked. Kindly go back, read the questions and have another go at answering them. Ducking and weaving will not do.

    Or, it might suit you better to visit the US to meet up with the American friends you have told us about. Together, you could drive from San Francisco to Los Angeles during which you will see much wind farm ugliness. During the drive you could also read out to your friends the vast amount of anti American bile you have long posted on this site. They might be puzzled as to how a friend could write those things but, just ignore them.

    You have previously mentioned the Americans’ ability to stuff things up. To reinforce your view you could visit the Palm Springs area in California – it’s not far from Los Angeles. Near there you will find the San Gorgonio Pass Wind Farm which contains over 3,000 turbines covering over 2,000 hectares.

    It is the ugliest man made creation I have seen.

    Is the farm another American stuff up or, is it an example of intelligent modern thinking which we should follow by, for example, adding another 3,000 wind turbines to Ravenshoe or some other presently undefiled area?

    • Ugliness is in the eye of the beholder. I lived in Mt Isa for a while and got used to the vista of metal and sunlight. It was pretty at night when the smelter lights were visible.
      I guess you believe that power stations are beautiful.
      As I said, ugliness is in the eye of the beholder, especially when it’s tainted by ideology.

  • Hello 17….

    Thank you for your observation that your energy supply and storage system is none of my business. Do I take it your response will be the same should I ask if you have ever been conscripted and what your thoughts are on the matter?

    I also appreciated your suggestion I may not have noticed that technology marches on. I went from biplanes to monoplanes from fixed to retractable undercarriages, from propellers to jets, from manually operated parachutes to ejection seats and from guns to heat seeking missiles and finally, from fixed wings to rotating wings.

    Until your revelation I believed all this technological marching on came from rubbing two pieces of kryptonite together. I thank you for your guidance.

    Likewise, I’m impressed that at Mt Isa ugliness is replaced with prettiness at nightfall. It’s just too damn bad the sun has to come up and spoil it all.

    Your suggestion my view of ugliness is tainted by ideology is puerile. I saw Mt Isa, Newcastle, Broken Hill, Whyalla and Port Kembla in the 60s, 70s and 80s. They were hideous affairs no matter what ideology you followed. Wind turbines match them.

  • Do I take it your response will be the same should I ask if you have ever been conscripted and what your thoughts are on the matter?
    My response is always up to me. I couldn’t care less how it is judged.
    They were hideous affairs no matter what ideology you followed. Wind turbines match them.
    Except that the beauty or otherwise of wind turbines persistently comes up in a political point scoring context – http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/joe-hockey-warns-clean-energy-and-utterly-offensive-windfarms-are-in-his-budget-crosshairs-20140502-37msv.html
    And – http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-06-11/abbott-wants-to-reduce-wind-farms-wishes-ret-never-implemented/6539164
    And – https://theyvoteforyou.org.au/people/senate/tasmania/eric_abetz/policies/20 I don’t recall any frequent political discussion about the appearance of Mt Isa, Newcastle, Broken Hill, Whyalla and Port Kembla.
    It is purely ideological, and to deny that is to deny the obvious.

  • 1735069….have you met anyone who honestly believes that wind farms are aesthetically pleasing or is it simply a fact that they fall into the same category as other sources of energy….pretty damned ordinary.

  • Hello 17…

    I regret my questions caused such upset.

    Nevertheless, I will blunder on. Could you tell us whether your household owns one or more Prius’ or similar?

    If you do then it indicates you have some belief in your cause. If not could it be you are a sanctimonious windbag?

    I commented about Port Kembla etc because ugliness is just that. In fact, as I’m all in favour of capitalism then according to your reasoning I should not see ugliness in the places I mentioned but, beauty. Your comment is as puerile today as it was several days ago.

    Finally, there is no point in pasting URLs – I don’t follow them. Some time ago I, along with several others, found that often enough the pieces you linked to were destructive of your own arguments.

  • Any sanctimonious behaviour is exhibited by those above who claim that they don’t have a “cause”, but at the same time abuse anyone who advocates the phasing out of the carbon economy.
    As for “Prius or similar”, my runabout is a Suzuki Alto which uses fewer litres per 100km than a Prius. It cost me about one third the price of a Prius.
    I never cease to be amused by those who regard hybrid vehicles as political statements rather than efficient means of transport. Toyota is laughing all the way to the bank.
    My decisions are based on common sense, not extremist ideology. Talk about pot and kettle……

  • Hello 17…

    You are peerless in your ability to swerve, duck, pivot and weave. One would have more success reasoning with a stampede than holding you to a subject.

    Nearly 2500 years a soldier called Xenophon wrote: “There is small risk a general will be regarded with contempt by those he leads, if, whatever he may have to preach he shows himself best able to perform.” Or, as today’s digger might say: “Put your money where your mouth is or shut up”.

    If you are going to preach about phasing out the carbon economy it would help your case if you used other sources of energy.

    You don’t.

    I believe sanctimonious windbag remains an accurate description of you.

  • If you are going to preach about phasing out the carbon economy
    Show me where I “preached about phasing out the carbon economy”.
    Scroll up – I wrote that posters here were abusing those who did.
    The irony is that Kev’s post is a fine example of “sanctimonious windbagging” as it is a complaint about government subsidy to renewables, ignoring completely the fact that worldwide government subsidies to the petro chemical industry have been around for decades and far exceed anything going to renewables.
    That inconvenient fact seems to have sailed right over your collective heads, and as usual, your only recourse is name calling.
    Read it and weep – http://priceofoil.org/content/uploads/2014/11/G20-Fossil-Fuel-Bailout-Full.pdf

  • Hello 17….

    Despite past form on the matter, your latest piece of slipperiness slowed me right up – hence the delay in responding.

    Kev made some acidic comments on an article and you then claimed it amounted to “sanctimonious windbagging”.

    If you are correct, then it means you have unearthed a definition of sanctimonious not previously known. On the other hand, it could mean you are writing bollocks.

    As you will surely deny writing any such thing, would you please provide a reference that substantiates your approach that an attack on an article constitutes sanctimony.

    The usual requests apply – namely, no ducking, no weaving – just the reference thanks.

    • As a Latin scholar (not many of us left) I’m aware that the derivation of “sanctimonious” lies in the Latin “Sancti” which means “holy”.
      The sense of the usage is that it refers to the person preaching in a “holier than thou” manner, making unsolicited judgements about others and their motives.
      Comments such as –
      Solar an (sic) wind can’t deliver baseload power for very obvious reasons and the $2.4 billion costs of the project are going to cost $10.8 billion worth of subsidies to reach the target.
      Oh, and the 17 projects are not going to happen at all, at least not in the near future.

      fit that description pretty accurately.
      Remember, Kev made these pronouncements first – I was simply commenting.
      Who’s “sanctimonious”?

      • unsolicited judgements Other than “can’t deliver base load power” the text you cite is me quoting the article in the paper so not judgemental at all and definitely not unsolicited. It’s my blog and I make comments on my own initiative for my own purpose. Certainly not to entertain of teach you anything…as if.

        So that leaves “can’t deliver base load power”? Have we sorted out the batteries over the last week odd and I missed it or are you just being loose with your criticism.

        • But Kev, you forget, he is the only one that can utter ” Unapologetic Insolence from an Aging Subversive” it says so on his failure of a blog.
          And now he claims to be able to write it in Latin as well.
          I am sure that his choice of students will understand him, as that seems to be the level of his diction.

          • I am sure that his choice of students will understand him, as that seems to be the level of his diction.
            You’d get on well with Donald Trump.
            Ridiculing people with disabilities is right up his alley.
            By the way, my humble blog has 105,923 unique page views. The most popular referring site is this one.
            Now that is funny………..

  • Now watch Ms Witless slip into her pink boxing shoes.

    • Not only pink boxing shoes, but manages to make a dig at him an assumption that I was ridiculing his students. Very fucking intelligent.

      And makes out that page views are comments. Most people looking at his page would be looking for a laugh for the day.

  • I was ridiculing his students.
    Ridiculing people with disabilities is precisely what you did.
    Read what you wrote carefully – I am sure that his choice of students will understand him
    Then explain what is meant by his choice of students, and given that the students I support have disabilities, explain how that is not ridicule. I’ve been in this field since 1971, and have learned that those who pay out on people with disabilities are cowardly or ignorant, or both.
    And explain where I indicated that page views on my blogs were comments. That is a figment of your imagination. By the way, my humble blog has recorded 161,001 comments according to the stats page.
    You have one of two problems. Either you can’t read English, or you are thick. Which is it?

  • Oh my deary me!!! Your choice of students is not a comment on your students it is a comment on your choice. I have several relatives who have learning disabilities and have met some of the dickheads who purport to be capable of teaching them anything. So fuck off with your holier than thou attitude. If you want attitude I have got plenty of it for pricks like you.
    As for my cowardly ignorance. if you have the unfortunate happenstance of ever bumping into me you will find out how cowardly I can be, I will add that to the insult of being called a liar by you and your other cohorts who don’t check up on facts before influencing authors with your own bloated sense of importance.

  • I have several relatives who have learning disabilities
    Yep – congenital issues are a common factor. From – https://www.nichd.nih.gov/health/topics/learning/conditioninfo/pages/causes.aspx
    “These differences are present from birth and often are inherited.”
    Ever sought a diagnosis?
    and have met some of the dickheads who purport to be capable of teaching them anything
    I don’t know about other states, but in Queensland you need post grad qualifications to teach students with disabilities. It’s a specialized field requiring specific additional skills and knowledge.
    I will add that to the insult of being called a liar by you and your other cohorts who don’t check up on facts before influencing authors with your own bloated sense of importance
    You will need to explain this statement, it makes no sense.
    So fuck off with your holier than thou attitude
    You might find this helpful – http://mentalhealth.openpathcollective.org/anger-management/?gclid=CJ2xjLHrucsCFYKVvAod4n4Hcg

  • Glad to explain that statement.
    Let’s start with some labels for yourself.

    Ignorant, you were ignorant of the fact that there was an “opt out parade” in 7 Battalion, but you gave your word that there wasn’t one.

    Liar, therefore you lied to the author.

    Integrity, when you found on this site that there were 2 people who were on that parade, you lacked the integrity to retract the statement.

    Coward, for the same reason, you couldn’t let this author know that you weren’t cognisant of the facts.

    Some call you numbers, I call you alphabet, at least the first 3 A B C.

    Arrogant Bombastic Conceited.

    And that from me is all on the subject. Get a life.

  • Let’s get a few facts straight. In the first place, when I was interviewed by the author you refer to, I was asked two questions. The first was “Were you ever given the option not to be sent to Vietnam?” I answered “no” because that was the truth. Then he asked me if I had heard of “opt-out parades”. Again, I answered “no” because at that stage I had not. First I heard of these alleged parades was when reference was made to them on this site.
    Being a student of history, I began researching the issue through the AWM. There is no record in any of their material to opt-out parades. Dapin found the same during his research.
    No Nasho that I have asked has any recollection of being personally involved in such a parade. A few talk about a “rumour”, but that’s as far as it goes.
    I still have an open mind about the issue, but because my recollection doesn’t reconcile with yours, doesn’t make me a liar. I am continuing to research it because the truth is supreme. If you feel so strongly about it, you could always do the same.

  • Did you or did you not contact the author when you realised you were wrong??

  • Except I was not “wrong”.
    I gave him truthful answers. He interviewed hundreds of Nashos, and he didn’t need me to be second guessing his conclusions. I went through my own notes, diaries and letters written at the time (April – January 1969-70). I recorded several efforts to attempt to avoid service in SVN including applying for a posting to Education Corps and then when it came to choice of unit, requesting a posting to a battalion just returning from a tour. This is also documented in my book which is a product of the weekly letters I wrote home before and after deployment.
    This was the extent of the options available to me at the time. I can assure you, that if there had been an opportunity to opt out I would have taken it.
    What rankles with me is the statement “Every Nasho that went to Vietnam was a volunteer”. It rankles, because in my case (and according to Dapin in very many others, it is bullshit. When I see bullshit, I call it.
    Dapin records talk about opt-out parades, but despite attempts to do so has not been able to identify specifics. That confirms my memory and my records at the time, so I did not tell him he was “wrong”.
    I am planning a week at the AWM later this year to research this and other topics relating to the experience of Nashos at the time. I would welcome any information which documents times, places, and names of COs calling such parades. So far, I’ve been unable to find any documentation on unit records confirming the existence of such parades. I’d welcome any information (primary sources – not anecdote) that clarifies the record.
    I continue to blog about these issues – as I have every right to, but am careful to base anything I write on the truth. Occasionally I get published. Here is something I prepared earlier – https://independentaustralia.net/australia/australia-display/reflections-on-the-fall,4404

  • I don’t know whether you are a complete idiot or were you just in awe of Dapin that he never found anybody that attended such a parade, and you couldn’t bring yourself to burst his little bubble, and tell him that you had knowledge of 2 people on this site that claimed to be on such a parade. I know for a fact that I was on such a parade. Which was attended by the CO Grey. All your petty pouting will not change that fact.
    Now you have stated that the truth is supreme, but it obviously isn’t because since previously stating that I was on such a parade, you or your esteemed (in your eyes) author has deemed not to contact me for my version of events. You say you still have an open mind on the issue. Well that is also obviously bullshit, because I have never been contacted.
    It doesn’t matter to me how much you write or who you write to when you are so obviously biased.
    You don’t want to find out any proof at all about the parades because you were deemed not suitable for inclusion. You were just another conscientious objector not worth spit. By not taking up the offer that made me a volunteer, so stick that where the Sun don’t shine.
    It is my recollection that the only people who were asked to join the parade had a compassionate reason. I can only think that I was asked simply because I was married and had a very young son. It is also my recollection on that parade that no one took up the offer. That made all of us on that parade volunteers. You tried everything you could to get out of it and failed, you have spent your miserable life since blaming all and sundry for that fail, and can’t bear the thought that there are others that thought different.
    AS for being a student of history, I presume that your type of history will be written by people who read the Independent, the Guardian or listen to the Fairfax and ABC media.
    I don’t think there is much reason to carry on with this subject, I think you have shown to the other “gentle readers” of this site how much of a self centred dick you truly are.

    Oh PS he interviewed 150 chosen Nashos hardly “hundreds”.

  • Provide the date and time of the parade and refer me to any existing AWM record. Until you can do this, your account is hearsay – not history. I’m not saying it didn’t happen, but any claim that CO Grey breached government policy at the time (as he would have, had he called such a parade), is a big call.
    Your claim also infers that such a parade was by invitation only. “Deemed not suitable for inclusion” is a very strange choice of words, and infers that the CO was playing favourites. That’s a slur on his integrity. The NS act made it crystal clear that the only way to avoid conscription was to convince a magistrate that you were a conscientious objector. For an officer commanding an infantry battalion to undermine that rather bizarre concept of fairness (when the whole process was a moral absurdity because it was based on random selection) sounds far fetched.
    By the way, You have every opportunity to contradict Dapin’s account on the public record. Why not do so.
    I successfully had the claim that every Nasho in Vietnam was a volunteer removed from the Anzac Day website for schools by politely pointing out that the statement was a myth. There’s nothing stopping you doing the same if you’re sure your right. It would be a bloody sight more rational than abuse.

  • Having no need to keep a diary for future money earning books or the possible need to seek compensation out of the Government for having the gall to ask me to serve my country, I have not the exact date or time of said parade. But I do find it passing strange that 2 independent accounts of that parade have been mentioned on this site.
    That is not hearsay.
    As for CO Grey’s integrity, I would say that he was more of a judge of character than you give him credit for, he, and whoever else you wrote your whining letters to, certainly had you pigeon-holed.
    As it is you can keep on bitching till your last breath, it will not change a bloody thing.

    • I kept a diary and wrote over 150 letters because I wanted to record and share my experience with my family. The idea of writing an account only entered my head when my mother died in 2001, and one of my sisters (on looking again at the letters resurrected in mum’s treasures) suggested I should try to write something.
      As for “future money earning books”, you have a bizarre idea both of my mindset in 1970 and the publishing business these days.
      All I was intent on doing in 1970 was getting home in one piece and getting back to the job I had been trained for and was successful at.
      As it happens, I’ve well and truly covered costs, and a proportion of the revenue goes towards my last Special School P & C, but writing doesn’t make you rich unless your output resembles J K Rowlings.
      I didn’t write any letters to CO Grey, by the way. You’re making stuff up again…….

      • You implied that you had tried several avenues without success, common sense tells me that the immediate avenue would be chain of command in the battalion, so I assumed you would have been in contact with the CO. This didn’t occur to you??
        I know of one man in the battalion, a Uni student from Victoria who did just that, after finally explaining himself to the CO he was moved into a non combative roll within the battalion. But as you have no personal knowledge of this it would only be hearsay.

  • Hello 17…

    You are getting together some impressive points for your CV – initially it was just sanctimonious windbag but now you are entitled to pompous windbag.

    You wrote: “Provide the date and time of the parade and refer me to any existing AWM record. Until you can do this, your account is hearsay – not history.”

    Here is an incident involving your beloved VC. It wasn’t recorded by me for the AWM or anyone else simply because there was no need to do so. Crystal clear on that 17…?

    I was flying three female nurses to Vung Tau, all of whom had been captured when 1 ATF overran a hospital NE of Nui Dat. The girls were crying, and when I asked the accompanying RAAF interpreter why, he advised they had been told by their VC superiors that if they were caught, the Australians would butcher and eat their children. Rather than let this happen, the young mothers had killed them. They were crying because they had murdered their kids because of this lie.

    I did not record the incident in my logbook, so I cannot say precisely when it happened although, I think it was between January and March 1969. Neither did I write it up in the squadron history which is now held by the AWM.

    Now tell me it didn’t happen or it’s hearsay.

    • Now tell me it didn’t happen or it’s hearsay.
      If you were treated in the same way I have been repeatedly on this site, I would call you a liar because you’ve described an incident that you were involved in, but that I didn’t witness. That would be irrational. Yet I have been called a liar and abused here because I report another aspect of my experience, (i.e. I never heard of an opt-out parade and never participated in one) that you did not personally witness.
      There is a unique brand of political correctness exhibited by some who post here. Woe betide anyone venturing an un-PC account which challenges the prevailing orthodoxy.
      The funny thing is, that the recognized and respected authors on the topic (Ekins & McNeill, Ham, Davies, Edwards et al) make no mention of this issue, and the only one who does is your bête noire, Dapin.
      Even funnier, is the fact that Dapin concludes that some kind of unofficial process may have occurred in some units, but he does so in the context of observing that if so, it was by exception, and frowned upon by those making policy at the time.
      On more than one occasion, questions were asked in parliament about the allegations that Nashos were being given the chance to opt out, and it was always consistently and firmly denied by the then Minister for the Army. Hansard is illuminating on the subject.
      The reason for the stern parliamentary denials was obvious. The Coalition government of the day couldn’t abide the possibility of public acknowledgment that there might be some Nashos who weren’t exactly busting a gut to go and kill Commies.
      It appears that critics of Dapin posting here have gone off half-cocked, without actually reading his account. The book has sold well, is readily available in good bookstores (and only $16.99 on iBooks). It’s always a good idea to actually read something before launching into rabid criticism.
      But from my point of view, none of this matters. What is important is that our kids and grandkids understand the truth, and myths such as “every Nasho that served in Vietnam was a volunteer” are debunked.
      This lie is one of many generated by the abject absurdity of war in general and Vietnam in particular, and sits well with Wilfred Owen’s “Dulce et decorum est”
      http://www.warpoetry.co.uk/owen1.html
      Owen did not survive his war, and nor did 172 ARA members and 143 Nashos in Vietnam. The least we can do is tell the truth about them and their sacrifice.

      • Hello 17…

        Any problems you have are of your own making.

        You won’t admit error. Instead, you manufacture ridiculous evasions to justify your inability to say: “Sorry – I was wrong” or “Sorry – I did not know that.”

        Your constant twisting and turning to justify your naive belief in Paul Ham’s book said much about you. Ham relied on hearsay and rumour when he wrote about 9 Squadron and rarely substantiated his criticisms. But, you would not accept Ham got it wrong over and over.

        It was clear to me he made up his mind before writing his story and instead of writing history, wrote what suited his pre determined beliefs.

        Is it coincidence that he later edited a self promoting book written by an individual Ham lauded in his “history” and who was so critical of 9? I cannot substantiate this but, I suspect Ham relied on this individual for many of his derogatory tales.

        Try opening both eyes 17… You will learn more that way.

  • Unbelievable!! The way you have been treated on this site?
    You call myself and one other contributor liars because you have no knowledge of a subject, but excuse HRT in the same circumstance. You are right, you are irrational.
    The rest of your diatribe is just that, blind belief of accounts from people who never experienced the subject matter.
    And as for wanting the absolute truth for future students and to honour the fallen, I didn’t realise how egotistical you are until I read that.
    And while on that subject I did not say that all Nashos volunteered for Vietnam, some like myself did.
    Out of some 63,000 or so Nashos that were called up, only 15,000 or so went to Vietnam, but you would have everyone believe all those called up were sent to Vietnam.
    Your total obsession with trying to discount the matter in such a way is very disturbing and you should take up your own advice to me, and go and see someone. There are some very good people at Greenslopes.

  • You call myself and one other contributor liars because you have no knowledge of a subject,
    Post the comment where I called you, or anyone else for that matter, a liar. My contention has always been that it never happened to me – that was the point that sailed right over your head in relation to HRT’s comment.
    The fact of the matter is, I have been called a liar over again because I posted the truth i.e. that I never participated in, heard of, or was aware of “opt-out” parades in my time in 7RAR.
    Yet the lie “every Nasho who served in Vietnam was a volunteer” is allowed through to the keeper.
    Amazing!

  • You have proven to me that you have no integrity, and you are totally self serving. You twist and turn like a worm in manure. I gave you months to redeem yourself, but it is plain for all to see that it isn’t in you to even ask for the circumstances nor the reason for any possible answer other than your own. Quite a despicable piece of work really.
    I never said that every Nasho that served in Vietnam was a volunteer but I do know that at the end of rookies there was a form to fill in, on that form you were asked to list 3 Corps in order of preference which you would like to join. Everyone of us knew that listing Infantry was volunteering for Vietnam. I personally listed Infantry 1 2 3, and I know others that did list it at least once.